Jump to content

  •  

Photo

Mistaken Notion Of Devotees


23 replies to this topic

#1 omgurudeva

omgurudeva
  • Moderators
  • 2,753 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 28 December 2016 - 09:10 AM

Meditation, as Guru, says is the "law of all laws". Its lawful. Kriya is the law of spiritual evolution.

 

In mediation we work with Law.

However, after reading stories of saints, we get a subtle expectation that miracles over-riding lawful results will start happening.

 

God exists Eternally. Maya shrouded world continues with His presence. It does not vanish.

So do mortal laws of healthful eating, right living, financial prudence, right work, thinking etc exist -- while a devotee is using the law of meditation to seek God.

 

I may be wrong. But do people here feel that things will of their own be better, get better because they love God? Is that lawful or even fair?



#2 mahavir108

mahavir108
  • Members+
  • 1,190 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 28 December 2016 - 09:20 AM

In my experience every day's meditation brings different perceptions. 

 

These constantly change because the nature of the mind itself is change.

 

Look for whats changeless. 

 

All these concepts and moods are fleeting.



#3 abja

abja
  • Members+
  • 143 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:U.S.

Posted 28 December 2016 - 08:50 PM

Ogd,
I think srz just answered part of your question on Board One, "Where is Heaven." Miracles are not 'over-riding' laws, they are the effect of someone knowing how to operate laws of the higher realms. And I think things do get better by loving God. "Everything in the future will improve if you are making a spiritual effort now." Loving God is perhaps the highest spiritual practice.

#4 omgurudeva

omgurudeva
  • Moderators
  • 2,753 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 28 December 2016 - 09:09 PM

Ogd,
I think srz just answered part of your question on Board One, "Where is Heaven." Miracles are not 'over-riding' laws, they are the effect of someone knowing how to operate laws of the higher realms. And I think things do get better by loving God. "Everything in the future will improve if you are making a spiritual effort now." Loving God is perhaps the highest spiritual practice.

Abja,

You are right Miracles are also lawful operation of hidden laws known to seers. Guru says so in AY. Yet again, hidden laws unknown to mortals are also laws. Not unlawful stuff.

When we love God - we might get tuned-in to get some right direction i.e. harmony with our nature. That is the working of law of attunement with harmony i.e. God. Instead of working in wrong directions, going in the right direction with work, health, finances will have better outcomes. The same engine with the same power on the right track will go toward the right destination.

 

So directionally things may get better. However the "work" of moving in that direction is still with us. God won't magically do the work for us. Heaven's won't open up and fix our bad habits of eating, non-exercise, financial imprudence, etc. Love of God may bring in love for self-control which will lead to right eating, living etc. But the sustained effort of self-control, everyone knows, is not for the faint hearted. Tremendous application of will and effort and persistence is required. Nothing falls down from heavens or grows on Trees. God doesn't magically throw fruits of Good health, Intelligence, Right Eating habits, and so forth if we do not make any effort. That would be very partial.

 

Its okay for someone not to seek God but live by the laws of God. That is honoring God too without the rituals of prayer and external show of devotion. Why would God be partial to one child?

 

When I read stories of Kriyabans in trouble. It makes me realize --- nothing ever will happen of itself. If a Kriyaban can get in a shit-hole After burning karma with 40, 50, 100, 500 thousand Kriyas -- then everyone better watch out. The heaven's didn't open up and solve their troubles. Thats a massive massive Lesson.

 

Are we ready to learn the Lesson? People may dislike my saying so and consider me an unbeliever. Doesn't bother me. Prove to me today that each and every sincere Kriyaban will live and die in full human dignity  (not in shit hole) - if they do nothing else but serve at SRF centers, at all convocations, sing all the Kirtans and go to all meditations plus read all SRF books. 

It ain't gonna happen. :)

 

Mother Teresa singularly raised the point that humans have a basic right to die in dignity -- if not live so. Even the abandoned have a right to die cleanly and cared for. Not like a worm or an animal left to die somewhere. How more precious is a human in whom a living God breathes. How much more dignified should be the death of a seeker of Self in All! My heart aches and breaks to see mistaken notions leading humans to a death alley of indignity and self destruction based on false beliefs and sheer irrationality based on mis-interpretation of scriptures.



#5 omgurudeva

omgurudeva
  • Moderators
  • 2,753 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 28 December 2016 - 09:12 PM

In my experience every day's meditation brings different perceptions. 

 

These constantly change because the nature of the mind itself is change.

 

Look for whats changeless. 

 

All these concepts and moods are fleeting.

I have been ruminating over the sad troubles of Kriybans in trouble on another thread, Mahavir.

Its hard to reconcile when genuinely virtuous fall in shit - holes, esp at old age. Why? Why? Why?

How bad can they be? Worse than the drug traffickers or even not-so-evil Pop Stars who move around in BMWs and sail in Yatches and give caviar to their pets and bathe in champagne?? Really? Is that even funny? Show me the justice or rationality of it all? Even some sensibility of why its okay?

 

There is a warning and a Lesson in this. Imo. The pop start worked hard, didn't care as much about Kriya. Just worked hard to earn fame and money. They get to use the money they earn, even selfishly. But they get to use it the way they want to. Period.

 

If a Kriyaban can get in a shit-hole After burning karma with 40, 50, 100, 500 - thousand Kriyas -- then everyone better watch out. The heaven's didn't open up and solve their troubles. Thats a massive massive Lesson.
 
Being a Kriyaban won't save anyone from living lawfully. Save Anyone from the work to fulfill laws of financial prudence, healthful eating and so forth.
 
Mother Teresa singularly raised the point that humans have a basic right to die in dignity -- if not live so. Even the abandoned have a right to die cleanly and cared for. Not like a worm or an animal left to die somewhere. How more precious is a human in whom a living God breathes. How much more dignified should be the death of a seeker of Self in All! My heart aches and breaks to see mistaken notions leading humans to a death alley of indignity and self destruction based on false beliefs and sheer irrationality based on mis-interpretation of scriptures.
 
Are we ready to learn the Lesson?


#6 JaiGuru

JaiGuru
  • Members+
  • 3,566 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 28 December 2016 - 11:29 PM

 

In my experience every day's meditation brings different perceptions. 

 

These constantly change because the nature of the mind itself is change.

 

Look for whats changeless. 

 

All these concepts and moods are fleeting.

I have been ruminating over the sad troubles of Kriybans in trouble on another thread, Mahavir.

Its hard to reconcile when genuinely virtuous fall in shit - holes, esp at old age. Why? Why? Why?

 

I know from experience that loving God and seeking God through love causes God to supply our needs. You probably heard the saying of Jesus Christ "Seek ye the kingdom of God first and all these things shall be added unto you". 

 

However, God can also test the love of his devotees. In one of the conversations Guruji had with Divine Mother, he asked her why the people of India who love her the most are having to suffer in so many ways and Her reply was "Those who love me the most are the ones I test the most". Why do we have to unlock all the mysteries in God's Lila and is that even possible before attaining God realization. Given our human limitations, I think the best we can do is to meditate and carry out our duties peacefully while helping those in need to the extent we can.



#7 simple

simple
  • Members+
  • 1,123 posts
  • Gender:Not Telling

Posted 28 December 2016 - 11:32 PM

Meditation, as Guru, says is the "law of all laws". Its lawful. Kriya is the law of spiritual evolution.

 

In mediation we work with Law.

However, after reading stories of saints, we get a subtle expectation that miracles over-riding lawful results will start happening.

 

God exists Eternally. Maya shrouded world continues with His presence. It does not vanish.

So do mortal laws of healthful eating, right living, financial prudence, right work, thinking etc exist -- while a devotee is using the law of meditation to seek God.

 

I may be wrong. But do people here feel that things will of their own be better, get better because they love God? Is that lawful or even fair?

 

I don't expect that things will get better (meaning easier) because of Kriya.  But I do expect that I will be better able to face what comes my way because of living the kriya path.  It has already been so with me.  Where it not for the Kriya path and Guruji, I would have been a very lost soul.  Life was not easy for me after coming on this path, but inwardly, I felt that I had Someone who was with me throughout my struggles. 

 

OGD, life in general is tough in the late 20's and early 40's of one's life.  40's is when mid-life crisis occurs. A sort of an adult "teenage rebellion".  I am not sure if you are in this age bracket, but if you are, hang in there and you might want to look up western astrology on mid-life crisis, as it will help you understand what the purpose of this passage of time is all about.  It helped me understand it a little better.  It really gets good after this period.  Everything falls into place, there is a peace and a calmness that replaces the turmoil and the rebellion. 



#8 mahavir108

mahavir108
  • Members+
  • 1,190 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 29 December 2016 - 02:40 AM

 

In my experience every day's meditation brings different perceptions. 

 

These constantly change because the nature of the mind itself is change.

 

Look for whats changeless. 

 

All these concepts and moods are fleeting.

I have been ruminating over the sad troubles of Kriybans in trouble on another thread, Mahavir.

Its hard to reconcile when genuinely virtuous fall in shit - holes, esp at old age. Why? Why? Why?

How bad can they be? Worse than the drug traffickers or even not-so-evil Pop Stars who move around in BMWs and sail in Yatches and give caviar to their pets and bathe in champagne?? Really? Is that even funny? Show me the justice or rationality of it all? Even some sensibility of why its okay?

 

There is a warning and a Lesson in this. Imo. The pop start worked hard, didn't care as much about Kriya. Just worked hard to earn fame and money. They get to use the money they earn, even selfishly. But they get to use it the way they want to. Period.

 

If a Kriyaban can get in a shit-hole After burning karma with 40, 50, 100, 500 - thousand Kriyas -- then everyone better watch out. The heaven's didn't open up and solve their troubles. Thats a massive massive Lesson.
 
Being a Kriyaban won't save anyone from living lawfully. Save Anyone from the work to fulfill laws of financial prudence, healthful eating and so forth.
 
Mother Teresa singularly raised the point that humans have a basic right to die in dignity -- if not live so. Even the abandoned have a right to die cleanly and cared for. Not like a worm or an animal left to die somewhere. How more precious is a human in whom a living God breathes. How much more dignified should be the death of a seeker of Self in All! My heart aches and breaks to see mistaken notions leading humans to a death alley of indignity and self destruction based on false beliefs and sheer irrationality based on mis-interpretation of scriptures.
 
Are we ready to learn the Lesson?

 

 

 

Each one's karmas are different.

 

God often uses the body as a means to work out the vestiges of karma, as he did with Sri Gyanamata's suffering toward the end of life, or Rajarsi's brain tumor.

 

Others have difficult financial circumstances, or all manner of other troubles.

 

Not to minimize the sufferings of others, but we certainly have it easier in this day and age than for example the disciples of Christ, many of whom had to suffer violent death, persecutions and martyrdom.

 

Look at the way Swami Vivekananda lived; he worked like an elephant to his dying day, feeling acutely the sufferings of the poor and downtrodden masses, making pilgrimage to Amarnath despite severe asthma, and giving counsel and spiritual instruction to anyone even when he was too sick to do so (just like his guru had done in final days).

 

Its in imposing one's soul nature over the laws of nature all the way unto death that we conquer this world and this body.



#9 mahavir108

mahavir108
  • Members+
  • 1,190 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 29 December 2016 - 02:42 AM

 

Meditation, as Guru, says is the "law of all laws". Its lawful. Kriya is the law of spiritual evolution.

 

In mediation we work with Law.

However, after reading stories of saints, we get a subtle expectation that miracles over-riding lawful results will start happening.

 

God exists Eternally. Maya shrouded world continues with His presence. It does not vanish.

So do mortal laws of healthful eating, right living, financial prudence, right work, thinking etc exist -- while a devotee is using the law of meditation to seek God.

 

I may be wrong. But do people here feel that things will of their own be better, get better because they love God? Is that lawful or even fair?

 

I don't expect that things will get better (meaning easier) because of Kriya.  But I do expect that I will be better able to face what comes my way because of living the kriya path.  It has already been so with me.  Where it not for the Kriya path and Guruji, I would have been a very lost soul.  Life was not easy for me after coming on this path, but inwardly, I felt that I had Someone who was with me throughout my struggles. 

 

OGD, life in general is tough in the late 20's and early 40's of one's life.  40's is when mid-life crisis occurs. A sort of an adult "teenage rebellion".  I am not sure if you are in this age bracket, but if you are, hang in there and you might want to look up western astrology on mid-life crisis, as it will help you understand what the purpose of this passage of time is all about.  It helped me understand it a little better.  It really gets good after this period.  Everything falls into place, there is a peace and a calmness that replaces the turmoil and the rebellion. 

 

 

 

The three on average Saturn Returns are the real 'crises' we go through in life.

 

the second is harsher than the first, generally, and the third is often where one perishes.



#10 omgurudeva

omgurudeva
  • Moderators
  • 2,753 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 29 December 2016 - 12:09 PM

 

 

I may be wrong. But do people here feel that things will of their own be better, get better because they love God? Is that lawful or even fair?

 

 Where it not for the Kriya path and Guruji, I would have been a very lost soul. 

 

OGD, life in general is tough in the late 20's and early 40's of one's life.  40's is when mid-life crisis occurs. A sort of an adult "teenage rebellion".  I am not sure if you are in this age bracket, but if you are, hang in there and you might want to look up western astrology on mid-life crisis, as it will help you understand what the purpose of this passage of time is all about.  It helped me understand it a little better.  It really gets good after this period.  Everything falls into place, there is a peace and a calmness that replaces the turmoil and the rebellion. 

 

Yes, same stands true for me. Guru and his sadhana has given a centering that was missing in my life prior and continues to be a fuel.

I am in my 40s. I did have a mid-life crisis I think, some 4-5 years ago. From childhood I was a very questioning, outspoken and thus a "rebellious" individual.

That also meant that monastic life wouldn't suit me in this incarnation. Even Possibly in future  (Questioners do not make good monks for community living where a definite hierarchy and strict obedience are basic rules. ) :)

I am not sure whether things will get easier or better. I would certainly like if that happens! :)



#11 omgurudeva

omgurudeva
  • Moderators
  • 2,753 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 29 December 2016 - 12:11 PM

 

 

Look at the way Swami Vivekananda lived; he worked like an elephant to his dying day, feeling acutely the sufferings of the poor and downtrodden masses, making pilgrimage to Amarnath despite severe asthma, and giving counsel and spiritual instruction to anyone even when he was too sick to do so (just like his guru had done in final days).

 

Its in imposing one's soul nature over the laws of nature all the way unto death that we conquer this world and this body.

 

I found this most touching. And its true. How unselfish are such souls! Our Guru also.

Those are beautiful words about Swamiji that you posted Mahavir. He was so devoted to Sri RK and serving him and the mission given to him by his Guru!



#12 omgurudeva

omgurudeva
  • Moderators
  • 2,753 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 29 December 2016 - 03:33 PM

 

 

In my experience every day's meditation brings different perceptions. 

 

These constantly change because the nature of the mind itself is change.

 

Look for whats changeless. 

 

All these concepts and moods are fleeting.

I have been ruminating over the sad troubles of Kriybans in trouble on another thread, Mahavir.

Its hard to reconcile when genuinely virtuous fall in shit - holes, esp at old age. Why? Why? Why?

 

I know from experience that loving God and seeking God through love causes God to supply our needs. You probably heard the saying of Jesus Christ "Seek ye the kingdom of God first and all these things shall be added unto you". 

 

However, God can also test the love of his devotees. In one of the conversations Guruji had with Divine Mother, he asked her why the people of India who love her the most are having to suffer in so many ways and Her reply was "Those who love me the most are the ones I test the most". Why do we have to unlock all the mysteries in God's Lila and is that even possible before attaining God realization. Given our human limitations, I think the best we can do is to meditate and carry out our duties peacefully while helping those in need to the extent we can.

 

JG

I have had instances of answered prayers as well. But that doesn't mean *all* prayers were answered or those that were, manifested in the timelines I thought were reasonable. :)

 

Then I might have a different perspective on what Jesus meant by "Seek God first"

Seeking God first doesn't imply that "After" seeking God rest of duties should be ignored. Jesus never said Seek God "only" for 24 hours a day meditate and pray -- because for most mortals thats an impossibility.
Seeking God first, imo, means putting God and His principles above personal ego, name, fame etc. Seeking God first means being selfless not selfish. Thats putting God first, ahead of one's ego needs and demands. However, It doesn't imply anywhere that seeking God first means not performing one's duties. Infact in the performance of one's duties -- God must be foremost in all motivations.
 

I think Guruji taught very pragmatically for a reason. He has explained that current world conditions are different from when Christ was teaching. Life during his times were simpler and needs too were.

Our Guru has explicitly said -- save money, put some money in govt bonds etc. Because he understands the complexity of current world conditions.

He also said helping others, doesn't mean one should become a pauper in donating all.

 

My feeling is Seeking God first has been mis-interpreted and thus the outcomes. Indian's though spiritual can be unclean and lazy. Look at our country. People throw filth outside their homes, even temples have rotting prasad and flowers. How is that seeking God first?



#13 JaiGuru

JaiGuru
  • Members+
  • 3,566 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 29 December 2016 - 04:44 PM

 

 

 

In my experience every day's meditation brings different perceptions. 

 

These constantly change because the nature of the mind itself is change.

 

Look for whats changeless. 

 

All these concepts and moods are fleeting.

I have been ruminating over the sad troubles of Kriybans in trouble on another thread, Mahavir.

Its hard to reconcile when genuinely virtuous fall in shit - holes, esp at old age. Why? Why? Why?

 

I know from experience that loving God and seeking God through love causes God to supply our needs. You probably heard the saying of Jesus Christ "Seek ye the kingdom of God first and all these things shall be added unto you". 

 

However, God can also test the love of his devotees. In one of the conversations Guruji had with Divine Mother, he asked her why the people of India who love her the most are having to suffer in so many ways and Her reply was "Those who love me the most are the ones I test the most". Why do we have to unlock all the mysteries in God's Lila and is that even possible before attaining God realization. Given our human limitations, I think the best we can do is to meditate and carry out our duties peacefully while helping those in need to the extent we can.

 

JG

I have had instances of answered prayers as well. But that doesn't mean *all* prayers were answered or those that were, manifested in the timelines I thought were reasonable. :)

 

Then I might have a different perspective on what Jesus meant by "Seek God first"

Seeking God first doesn't imply that "After" seeking God rest of duties should be ignored. Jesus never said Seek God "only" for 24 hours a day meditate and pray -- because for most mortals thats an impossibility.
Seeking God first, imo, means putting God and His principles above personal ego, name, fame etc. Seeking God first means being selfless not selfish. Thats putting God first, ahead of one's ego needs and demands. However, It doesn't imply anywhere that seeking God first means not performing one's duties. Infact in the performance of one's duties -- God must be foremost in all motivations.
 

I think Guruji taught very pragmatically for a reason. He has explained that current world conditions are different from when Christ was teaching. Life during his times were simpler and needs too were.

Our Guru has explicitly said -- save money, put some money in govt bonds etc. Because he understands the complexity of current world conditions.

He also said helping others, doesn't mean one should become a pauper in donating all.

 

My feeling is Seeking God first has been mis-interpreted and thus the outcomes. Indian's though spiritual can be unclean and lazy. Look at our country. People throw filth outside their homes, even temples have rotting prasad and flowers. How is that seeking God first?

 

 

There seems to be a disconnect over performance of duties. I clearly stated "Given our human limitations, I think the best we can do is to meditate and carry out our duties peacefully while helping those in need to the extent we can". We always have to do our part. Meditation must be followed up with practical activity performed with detachment. Just doing one or the other leads to mistakes and wrong results.



#14 GodAlways

GodAlways
  • Members+
  • 627 posts

Posted 29 December 2016 - 05:46 PM

'Change no circumstance, change me.' (Sr. Gyanamata)

 

'Heavenly Father, may every act of my will be impregnated with thy divine vitality. Ornament with thy grace my every concept, every expression, ever ambition.......O Divine Sculptor, chisel thou my life to thy design.' (I heard Brother Anandamoy voice this prayer at Convocation.) He jokingly commented that when God chisels things off us, we try to immediately stick them back on. :) He also said it's a very dangerous prayer, when we ask to be worked on........

 

I think our lives can get more difficult when we enter a Path like ours. If we want to grow, and we say we want to grow when we do enter such a Path, things can get challenging. But grace is always available. And the way we see things can make everything different. 


Spirit


#15 omgurudeva

omgurudeva
  • Moderators
  • 2,753 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 29 December 2016 - 09:09 PM

 

 

 

 

In my experience every day's meditation brings different perceptions. 

 

These constantly change because the nature of the mind itself is change.

 

Look for whats changeless. 

 

All these concepts and moods are fleeting.

I have been ruminating over the sad troubles of Kriybans in trouble on another thread, Mahavir.

Its hard to reconcile when genuinely virtuous fall in shit - holes, esp at old age. Why? Why? Why?

 

I know from experience that loving God and seeking God through love causes God to supply our needs. You probably heard the saying of Jesus Christ "Seek ye the kingdom of God first and all these things shall be added unto you". 

 

However, God can also test the love of his devotees. In one of the conversations Guruji had with Divine Mother, he asked her why the people of India who love her the most are having to suffer in so many ways and Her reply was "Those who love me the most are the ones I test the most". Why do we have to unlock all the mysteries in God's Lila and is that even possible before attaining God realization. Given our human limitations, I think the best we can do is to meditate and carry out our duties peacefully while helping those in need to the extent we can.

 

JG

I have had instances of answered prayers as well. But that doesn't mean *all* prayers were answered or those that were, manifested in the timelines I thought were reasonable. :)

 

Then I might have a different perspective on what Jesus meant by "Seek God first"

Seeking God first doesn't imply that "After" seeking God rest of duties should be ignored. Jesus never said Seek God "only" for 24 hours a day meditate and pray -- because for most mortals thats an impossibility.
Seeking God first, imo, means putting God and His principles above personal ego, name, fame etc. Seeking God first means being selfless not selfish. Thats putting God first, ahead of one's ego needs and demands. However, It doesn't imply anywhere that seeking God first means not performing one's duties. Infact in the performance of one's duties -- God must be foremost in all motivations.
 

I think Guruji taught very pragmatically for a reason. He has explained that current world conditions are different from when Christ was teaching. Life during his times were simpler and needs too were.

Our Guru has explicitly said -- save money, put some money in govt bonds etc. Because he understands the complexity of current world conditions.

He also said helping others, doesn't mean one should become a pauper in donating all.

 

My feeling is Seeking God first has been mis-interpreted and thus the outcomes. Indian's though spiritual can be unclean and lazy. Look at our country. People throw filth outside their homes, even temples have rotting prasad and flowers. How is that seeking God first?

 

 

There seems to be a disconnect over performance of duties. I clearly stated "Given our human limitations, I think the best we can do is to meditate and carry out our duties peacefully while helping those in need to the extent we can". We always have to do our part. Meditation must be followed up with practical activity performed with detachment. Just doing one or the other leads to mistakes and wrong results.

 

Sorry I missed that in the earlier reading. Seems we are well aligned here JG _/\_



#16 omgurudeva

omgurudeva
  • Moderators
  • 2,753 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 29 December 2016 - 09:11 PM

 

I think our lives can get more difficult when we enter a Path like ours. If we want to grow, and we say we want to grow when we do enter such a Path, things can get challenging. But grace is always available. And the way we see things can make everything different. 

I would agree with that GA. I think Guru mentions this somewhere saying devotee has to work harder not less than ordinary man -- for he has to seek God *and* fulfill all duties and obligations that others just focus on -- while keeping Spiritual principles foremost.

There certainly is a heavy price externally for internal grace

This path is like a razor's edge. Mistaken notions can cause a lot of trauma and disasters -- that was my point in thinking aloud on this thread.



#17 paulo

paulo
  • Members+
  • 4,733 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:East Bay Area, California

Posted 29 December 2016 - 09:21 PM

 

 

In my experience every day's meditation brings different perceptions. 

 

These constantly change because the nature of the mind itself is change.

 

Look for whats changeless. 

 

All these concepts and moods are fleeting.

I have been ruminating over the sad troubles of Kriybans in trouble on another thread, Mahavir.

Its hard to reconcile when genuinely virtuous fall in shit - holes, esp at old age. Why? Why? Why?

How bad can they be? Worse than the drug traffickers or even not-so-evil Pop Stars who move around in BMWs and sail in Yatches and give caviar to their pets and bathe in champagne?? Really? Is that even funny? Show me the justice or rationality of it all? Even some sensibility of why its okay?

 

There is a warning and a Lesson in this. Imo. The pop start worked hard, didn't care as much about Kriya. Just worked hard to earn fame and money. They get to use the money they earn, even selfishly. But they get to use it the way they want to. Period.

 

If a Kriyaban can get in a shit-hole After burning karma with 40, 50, 100, 500 - thousand Kriyas -- then everyone better watch out. The heaven's didn't open up and solve their troubles. Thats a massive massive Lesson.
 
Being a Kriyaban won't save anyone from living lawfully. Save Anyone from the work to fulfill laws of financial prudence, healthful eating and so forth.
 
Mother Teresa singularly raised the point that humans have a basic right to die in dignity -- if not live so. Even the abandoned have a right to die cleanly and cared for. Not like a worm or an animal left to die somewhere. How more precious is a human in whom a living God breathes. How much more dignified should be the death of a seeker of Self in All! My heart aches and breaks to see mistaken notions leading humans to a death alley of indignity and self destruction based on false beliefs and sheer irrationality based on mis-interpretation of scriptures.
 
Are we ready to learn the Lesson?

 

 

 

Each one's karmas are different.

 

God often uses the body as a means to work out the vestiges of karma, as he did with Sri Gyanamata's suffering toward the end of life, or Rajarsi's brain tumor.

 

Others have difficult financial circumstances, or all manner of other troubles.

 

Not to minimize the sufferings of others, but we certainly have it easier in this day and age than for example the disciples of Christ, many of whom had to suffer violent death, persecutions and martyrdom.

 

Look at the way Swami Vivekananda lived; he worked like an elephant to his dying day, feeling acutely the sufferings of the poor and downtrodden masses, making pilgrimage to Amarnath despite severe asthma, and giving counsel and spiritual instruction to anyone even when he was too sick to do so (just like his guru had done in final days).

 

Its in imposing one's soul nature over the laws of nature all the way unto death that we conquer this world and this body.

 

 


"God often uses the body as a means to work out the vestiges of karma, as he did with Sri Gyanamata's suffering toward the end of life, or Rajarsi's brain tumor."

 

I can't imagine that Sister G. had any residual karma to work out, M. 108.  Master said that He could find no trace of sin in her and also finally told her towards the end of her life that she had already attained Nirvikalpa Samadhi in her previous life.  She was bearing the karma of others at that point I think.  I would think the same was true of Rajarsi with his brain tumor as Master said he was His greatest male disciple.  I guess that's the "reward" great ones get when they achieve liberation and are then asked to return to help in a Master's work.  Something to look forward to, LOL.


God First! God Last! God Always! God Alone!






Greater then ever before is the need for purity of living and one-pointed determination and never-ceasing vigilance. The Kingdom of God is within you, and the portals are open wide to the expansion of all of your being in full consciousness of its glory. Press on and on.


#18 mahavir108

mahavir108
  • Members+
  • 1,190 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 30 December 2016 - 03:19 AM

 


"God often uses the body as a means to work out the vestiges of karma, as he did with Sri Gyanamata's suffering toward the end of life, or Rajarsi's brain tumor."

 

I can't imagine that Sister G. had any residual karma to work out, M. 108.  Master said that He could find no trace of sin in her and also finally told her towards the end of her life that she had already attained Nirvikalpa Samadhi in her previous life.  She was bearing the karma of others at that point I think.  I would think the same was true of Rajarsi with his brain tumor as Master said he was His greatest male disciple.  I guess that's the "reward" great ones get when they achieve liberation and are then asked to return to help in a Master's work.  Something to look forward to, LOL.

 

 

 

He said she was working out her astral and causal karma, and that the physical pain was not her own karma but that of disciples and loved ones she had known in that life.

 

But in the end karma is karma, whether our own or that of others. 

 

What matters is the inner aboveness through depth of realization and surrender.



#19 paulo

paulo
  • Members+
  • 4,733 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:East Bay Area, California

Posted 30 December 2016 - 12:36 PM

I guess I'm still unclear about Nirbikalpa Samadhi.  I thought it meant that you had achieved liberation, i.e. cosmic consciousness, but, apparently it just means that you don't need to take on a physical body on the earthly plane again but may still have some astral and causal karma to work off, per Sister G.

 

On the other hand, I've gotten the impression from some srf writings: Dr. Lewis, Master et al that it is possible to make the giant leap all the way from the earthly plane to cosmic consciousness too?!  

 

Or will most of us, once we've escaped the earthly plane, have to make a prolonged pit stop on the astral planet, Heiranyloka, to work off residual astral (and presumably) causal karma??


God First! God Last! God Always! God Alone!






Greater then ever before is the need for purity of living and one-pointed determination and never-ceasing vigilance. The Kingdom of God is within you, and the portals are open wide to the expansion of all of your being in full consciousness of its glory. Press on and on.


#20 GodAlways

GodAlways
  • Members+
  • 627 posts

Posted 30 December 2016 - 12:48 PM

I guess I'm still unclear about Nirbikalpa Samadhi.  I thought it meant that you had achieved liberation, i.e. cosmic consciousness, but, apparently it just means that you don't need to take on a physical body on the earthly plane again but may still have some astral and causal karma to work off, per Sister G.

 

On the other hand, I've gotten the impression from some srf writings: Dr. Lewis, Master et al that it is possible to make the giant leap all the way from the earthly plane to cosmic consciousness too?!  

 

Or will most of us, once we've escaped the earthly plane, have to make a prolonged pit stop on the astral planet, Heiranyloka, to work off residual astral (and presumably) causal karma??

 

NS - in the world but not of the world; no more desires; always in a state of God consciousness; bliss; joy; no limits? 

 

So far from where the ordinary person is at. No more 'world' really!  

 

No more:

 


Spirit


#21 mahavir108

mahavir108
  • Members+
  • 1,190 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 31 December 2016 - 03:05 AM

I guess I'm still unclear about Nirbikalpa Samadhi.  I thought it meant that you had achieved liberation, i.e. cosmic consciousness, but, apparently it just means that you don't need to take on a physical body on the earthly plane again but may still have some astral and causal karma to work off, per Sister G.

 

On the other hand, I've gotten the impression from some srf writings: Dr. Lewis, Master et al that it is possible to make the giant leap all the way from the earthly plane to cosmic consciousness too?!  

 

Or will most of us, once we've escaped the earthly plane, have to make a prolonged pit stop on the astral planet, Heiranyloka, to work off residual astral (and presumably) causal karma??

 

 

I think it depends on the will of God what happens to each soul individually.

 

The idea of eternal freedom while we're down here always seems far better than having to come back against our will, but what about if God wants us to come back to help others?

 

I think in the final lifetimes of the average kriyaban before full liberation there is a gradual growing intensity in sadhana with each lifetime.

 

In the one where liberation is attained, there would likely be only jivanmukti reached, and any successive ones where we return to help the Guru and work out astral and causal karma would be from taking on the karma of others. 



#22 omgurudeva

omgurudeva
  • Moderators
  • 2,753 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 01 January 2017 - 12:31 AM

I guess I'm still unclear about Nirbikalpa Samadhi.  I thought it meant that you had achieved liberation, i.e. cosmic consciousness, but, apparently it just means that you don't need to take on a physical body on the earthly plane again but may still have some astral and causal karma to work off, per Sister G.

 

On the other hand, I've gotten the impression from some srf writings: Dr. Lewis, Master et al that it is possible to make the giant leap all the way from the earthly plane to cosmic consciousness too?!  

 

Or will most of us, once we've escaped the earthly plane, have to make a prolonged pit stop on the astral planet, Heiranyloka, to work off residual astral (and presumably) causal karma??

Somewhere PY has said that no soul is fully redeemed unless it helps in the redemption of a few other souls.

This might have been the reason of Gyanamataji's earthly incarnation - which was without any sin and her having attained Nirvikalapa Samadhi in a previous lifetime. It seems the same case for Tara Mataji also.

Its also possible that like Sri Krishna and the perfected rishis re-born with him for the divine play of pure perfected love between Spirit and soul, that these souls may have prayed to Guru for a chance to serve Him which was given as its the highest offering of Love and Devotion that is accepted. In a letter to St Lynn, Py says this is the case -- many sought to be with Me in serving this work, but only St Lynn was the chosen one...

In God Alone, Guruji explicitly says "follow the example of St Lynn and Sister" -- he was quite outspoken about these two disciples during his own incarnation as perfect examples of discipleship. They obviously had come with him to serve His work and fulfill their own desire to serve the Guru perfectly. No other reason makes sense. Gyanamataji set the example of "twenty years of unruffled patience in her suffering without losing love for God." 



#23 rainbow

rainbow
  • Members+
  • 2,798 posts
  • Gender:Not Telling

Posted 01 January 2017 - 01:23 AM

In the AY - resurrection of Sri. Y. - all this is explained wonderfully. Happy New Year - IDF


A passage in the Mahabharata is as follows: "One should forgive, under any injury. It hath been said that the continuation of the species is due to man's being forgiving. Forgiveness is holiness; by forgiveness the universe is held together. Forgiveness is the might of the mighty; forgiveness is sacrifice; forgiveness is quiet of mind. Forgiveness and gentleness are the qualities of the Self-possessed. They represent eternal virtue."

#24 cheer

cheer
  • Members+
  • 1,787 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:USA
  • Interests:Gurus, Scripture, Love, SRF Books, Atoms, Life, Intuition, Light, Music, Oceans, People, Children, Animals, Trees, Stained Glass, Paleontology, Meteorology, Mysteries, Old Movies, Wizards, Coffee & Oranges

Posted 10 January 2017 - 03:21 AM

…there are two cosmic forces, one is the force of projection going out from the unmanifested consciousness of God producing, projecting that universe.  And then there is the other force, it is the cosmic force of attraction which draws everything back in to God’s consciousness again. And that is the universal power of love in all creation, inherent in all beings, even in every atom.  And that force is stronger, obviously than the one that is projecting, because otherwise none of us would ever get back again.

 

That force is stronger than the law of cause and effect, of karma.  And it’s very interesting, Master said since God is not bound by his cosmic law devotion is also necessary to summon his attention.  Devotional demand is greater than law, the law of cause and effect, because it touches the heart of God and makes him answer his naughty and good children alike.

 

Law is based on mathematical precision, justice weighted according to the law of cause and effect.  Devotion is based upon claiming God as your own true love.  Law is exacting in its demand, but love presupposes God’s mercy, and thereby attracts his response, whether or not the full measure of the law has been met.  Isn’t that tremendous?   .........

 

~Br. Anandamoy, Devotion


"Always remember: your Father loves you unconditionally." ~Paramahansa Yogananda

 

"I have just one prejudice, and that is a prejudice against prejudice." -- PY




Reply to this topic



  


0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users